Episode 10: Sibling Rivalry

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Hello, and welcome to Parenting Matters. Real talk from toddlers to teens. I'm your host, Rebecca Walsh, director of Early Childhood Matters in San Francisco, and I'm joined by my longtime mentor and co host, Belan Gioreto. Together, we're here to answer your parenting questions from the early years through adolescence. As seasoned and humble parents and early childhood educators, we bring over 50 years of combined experience in teaching, directing, and coaching parents. We started this podcast to help you raise resilient, confident kids and teens and to give you practical tools that can increase your confidence, effectiveness, and your joy in parenting. This is real Talk where we share multiple strategies because every child is unique, and we always explore what to try when just nothing else seems to be working. So let's get real, and let's get to it. [00:01:03] Speaker B: All right, well, welcome back, everybody. We are really excited to continue the conversation from last week's topic of introducing the sibling to really getting to more of. Once the siblings have grown up a little bit and they're already in that kind of fighting and getting into some sibling conflict and sibling rivalry stage, it can happen. It can happen. [00:01:25] Speaker C: It's a wonderful gift, giving your child a sibling, and it's a strength. Strength in many, many, many ways. But parents are often quite shocked at how siblings end up getting into arguments, fights, and really tricky things for parents that end up leading to parent burnout, because it can happen so often. So we're hoping to give you some. [00:01:46] Speaker D: Guidance so that you can have a calmer and happier family life and help siblings to avoid some of the. Some of the struggles that they go through. [00:01:56] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:01:56] Speaker A: And I think. [00:01:58] Speaker B: I know you said on the last. On our last episode that the relationship that your boys have today is one of the things that you're most proud of. [00:02:07] Speaker C: Yes. Yes. It's incredible to see how much they support each other. Even though they live on different coasts. They talk to each other all the time. And it's a. It's really rewarding as a parent to see that. [00:02:20] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. And I think that is something that we don't necessarily have control over the personalities or the. The age gap or the genders and all of that, but I think that there is something that we have influence over and something that we want to talk about today is like, what is the culture of our family? Right. And what do we allow siblings to do to each other? And what do we not allow? [00:02:45] Speaker C: Absolutely. And I think adding to that is very important for parents to look at their own relationship if they have siblings and what that was like for them. Some Are very positive, some are very negative. And obviously that's going to influence the way that you parent. You can get past that, but you have to be aware of it. [00:03:03] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And I think when you're looking at that, one of the things that can come up as well is what would I have wanted my parents to have done? Right, right, right. Like what would I have wanted my parents to, to have stopped that wasn't stopped or how could they have, you know, helped support us in developing those relationships? Yeah. [00:03:22] Speaker C: I think a lot of parents feel totally powerless and, and I think it's just the opposite. I think there's many things that parents can do and need to do. [00:03:30] Speaker B: Oh, that's awesome. That is, that is so empowering because I think, you know, and obviously I'm still in the thick of the sibling things of a 10, 13 and 16, 16 year old who are older now. But, but still the things come up. I do think that one of the reasons why as a parent it can get to that hopelessness point is that it's something that happens so often. Right? [00:03:53] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:03:53] Speaker B: Over and over and over again. And so there can be that tendency to sort of start to give up a little bit. [00:03:59] Speaker D: Yes, absolutely. [00:04:00] Speaker B: And so I love hearing from you and really in my own work as a parent, trying not to fall into that. [00:04:08] Speaker C: Right. [00:04:09] Speaker B: Mindset. I think for me, and I have three and they all have different personalities, but I think one of the things that I do keep coming back to is trying to focus on, well, what is it that as parents, what can we influence and really setting the tone for a family? And I, I was personally really inspired by something that Brene Brown said when she was talking about how she really wanted her children to feel safe in their family and that when they walked in the door they could take their armor off and that they knew that their, their home was a place where they would be loved and accepted. And she has a quote that she wrote about her family, sort of like a family manifesto and says we will laugh and sing and dance and create. We will always have permission to be ourselves with each other. No matter what. You will always belong here. [00:04:54] Speaker C: That's beautiful. [00:04:56] Speaker B: Yeah. And I, I think that really inspired me to think, oh my goodness. I actually as a parent I do have influence. Right. Over how my children feel. A sense of belonging in, in my home. [00:05:09] Speaker C: Absolutely right. [00:05:10] Speaker B: And, and by constantly coming back to holding them to certain expectations like we are a zero hitting family, we are a zero name calling family. And I think having a couple of those rules to where does that mean that my kids never hit each other? Does that mean they never called each other names? Absolutely not. But I think I was so inspired by this idea that as the parents, we could set the tone and create a family environment that was welcoming and that was loving. And so even though they will do the things that siblings do, it's like constantly coming back. And I think my husband Justin also really took that on. And being one of seven and being fifth, he really also wanted to make sure that the children weren't being teased, they weren't being called names, they weren't being dominated over. So I think just knowing that you do, as a parent, say, nope, that's a name calling. [00:06:07] Speaker C: Yeah. The power of that for children is incredible that they know that they have that and that one thing I think that helps with that, especially with younger kids, is to write down. Oh, yeah, some of the, you know, I wouldn't have more than five or six. You don't want 20. Yeah. But what are the important rules? [00:06:26] Speaker B: Sure. [00:06:27] Speaker C: You just described no hitting, no name calling. There might be other ones that you have. And when I was doing this with my kids, even when they were very young, before they could read, if I pointed to number three, they didn't have to say a word. And they would know what that was. And they could change their behavior. Not always, but a lot of times they would. And then that helps me to avoid over talking and over, you know, reminding them. [00:06:56] Speaker B: Sure. [00:06:56] Speaker C: And that's the power of a family meeting. The problem with the family meeting is you can. You do. [00:07:01] Speaker D: You can't hold it. [00:07:02] Speaker C: Only when there's a problem. Yeah. Which is what I was doing. If you do a family meeting, you want to do it consistently and you really want to hear your kids and you don't want to just do it when there's a problem. But it's very powerful. [00:07:14] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:07:15] Speaker C: And all these things send a message to kids that is very securitizing. [00:07:19] Speaker B: Yeah. That word, securitizing. I think that's such an important thing to think about in the context of sibling relationships. You know, do I feel secure? [00:07:29] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:07:30] Speaker B: You know, do I feel safe? [00:07:31] Speaker C: There's a lot of anxiety and fear for kids when they are sort of left to their own devices without parent guidance. And that's one of our biggest roles, is helping kids to feel secure, less afraid, and to feel that strength of a family. [00:07:48] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:07:49] Speaker B: Yeah. And I think we have a question that kind of will hit on this. So I think we'll go into it a little bit more. But I think there is sometimes a misconception. Right. That we shouldn't get involved at all in children's fights. And that may be the way that many of us were raised was like, hey, you guys sort it out. You gotta deal with it. You gotta solve your own problems. I'm not. Don't come to me unless you're bleeding kind of thing. [00:08:10] Speaker A: Right. [00:08:12] Speaker B: And so I think there, there is a question that we'll answer that I think we'll be able to unpack that a little bit. [00:08:17] Speaker C: Okay. [00:08:17] Speaker B: But yeah, but let's, let's jump into our first question because I think it's such an important one, such a classic one. And I'm sure anyone with siblings has had some, some level of this come up. So the parent writes in my kids always want everything to be fair. Her pancake is bigger. He gets to stay up later than me. She got a cupcake at school. [00:08:39] Speaker C: School. [00:08:39] Speaker B: And that's not fair. They are five and seven. Please help. [00:08:43] Speaker C: Well, as the great book Siblings Without Rivalry, which we highly recommend, states that there is is no fair trying for parents striving to make everything fair. You're actually increasing and flaming sibling rivalry. [00:08:58] Speaker A: Yes. [00:08:58] Speaker C: So it's helping kids to see, well, not everything is going to be fair. She got a cupcake at school because it was somebody's birthday. In your classroom, there wasn't a birthday. And to try to get that word sort of out of the vocabulary and look at difference. And difference is fine. [00:09:17] Speaker B: It's the idea of like equity versus equality. Right, right, right. [00:09:21] Speaker C: Good point. [00:09:22] Speaker B: And there's that, that great photo, which we'll have to link here, but of the three children looking at the baseball game. And in the first picture, it's everybody has two blocks and the taller child can see everything. The middle child can barely see. And then the youngest child can't see any, but they all have two blocks. And then the next picture is where the, the tallest child has no blocks to stand on. The, the middle child has two and then the, the youngest has three. And so it really the same amount of blocks but using them so that everyone gets their needs met. And I think that is a picture that you can you kind of talk about and discuss with your child. Like, is it fair for the youngest child to not be able to see? Yeah. Even though they have two blocks, the oldest child has two blocks. Is this fair? Right. [00:10:11] Speaker C: That would make a great family meeting. Yeah. And youngest children can go to these meetings. It's astounding how much they get out of it. [00:10:20] Speaker B: Absolutely, absolutely. And yeah, I do think that. That is such a trap, though, to fall into as a parent, and then you're cutting the piece of cake, and then it's like, no, it's bigger. So you cut it again, and then you cut it again. It's. [00:10:32] Speaker C: No one wins in that situation. It's a really slippery slope. And we as parents, unfortunately, fall into that and perpetuate it instead of sort of dousing it. [00:10:43] Speaker A: Yes. Yeah. [00:10:43] Speaker B: As far as strategies there, how do you walk yourself back if you've already kind of maybe been in that habit of trying to. [00:10:50] Speaker C: I think, having a discussion about using that. That great visual. Yeah. And. And to remind kids that although it may not look fair, it's definitely equitable and that's the way that the world works at different times. [00:11:08] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And you could even have that conversation and say, you know, I know in the past we've been focusing on trying to make everything fair, but right now we're going to shift in, you know, Mom's focus or Dad's focus is to make everything equitable but not equal. The way that I explained it to my kids, too, is like, if, you know, let's say somebody had a cupcake because somebody was having a birthday party, and then, you know, the other child finds out and gets upset, I would say to them, oh, so would you? Do you want me. Next time your class is having treats, you want me to tell them, you know what? Joey can't have a cupcake because it wouldn't be fair to his siblings. Right. [00:11:47] Speaker C: That's it. [00:11:47] Speaker B: And that kind of helped, I think, get their little wheels turning. Or when it was working to their advantage, like, let's say I was picking somebody up for preschool and a bunch of the families were going to get ice cream. Would I. I would say to my child, oh, maybe we shouldn't go to get ice cream because that wouldn't be fair to your siblings. [00:12:05] Speaker D: Right. [00:12:05] Speaker C: And they. [00:12:05] Speaker B: No, no, no, no. Okay. So you kind of use little typical moments like that to kind of show the perspective and ab. Um, and then I tried to make it really clear to them, too. Like, you know what? Sometimes you'll. You'll get ice cream after school because that's what's happening. But then another time somebody else will get. And we don't want to get in the habit of robbing each other of these little joys, because it wouldn't be fair. [00:12:30] Speaker C: I think that would make a great family meeting. And you're making the pancakes, and the kid. The child says, that's not fair. And you could just Point. Have this in the kitchen, number three. [00:12:40] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:12:40] Speaker C: And see, you might be surprised. I certainly was. Of how children accept that. [00:12:46] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:12:46] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:12:47] Speaker B: And I do think, like, overall, it was so liberating to me once my kids got this, because we really didn't have the constant. That's not fair. That's not fair. I think. Where else does this come up a lot? [00:12:59] Speaker C: I've seen it with affection. Oh, you're my mommy's laugh and I'm not. And it just gets out of control. And so the parent really has to help that dissipate because it's not a healthy situation because then the kids are only focused on what they don't have. [00:13:15] Speaker D: Instead of what they have. [00:13:17] Speaker B: And it becomes, you know, such a good point. [00:13:19] Speaker D: Just saturates everything they do. So the parent has to really work on this and not promote it. [00:13:26] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:13:27] Speaker B: And like you said, you're constantly. You're right. And shifting and, oh, well, okay, you guys can vote then. It really sends the message to the child that there is a deficit. Yeah. [00:13:37] Speaker C: You've just raised the green flag for your child to keep. To keep aware of this and to keep. Keep it alive. Which is very exhausting for everybody. [00:13:47] Speaker B: Absolutely. [00:13:48] Speaker C: But especially for the parent. [00:13:49] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. Well, let's move on to our second question. Okay. This next question is connected to what we were talking about in the intro here, the fighting. I know I'm not supposed to intervene in every fight, but how do you do that when not intervening so seems to always involve someone or both getting hurt? [00:14:10] Speaker C: Well, first of all, I'm not supposed to intervene. We want to say that that's not true. Certainly there's times when you want your children to be able to work something out. But, yeah, you're not. Intervening at times would be very inappropriate. So you have to take each situation and obviously not wait till someone's gotten hurt, because that's a very bad message for everybody involved. [00:14:37] Speaker D: So that you see yourself as assessing a situation. You know, do I think they can do this? Sending a positive message? Yeah, I think you guys can work this out. Let me know when it's done. I can't wait to hear what you come up with. But you're not walking away. You're not going downstairs. You're right close to it. [00:14:57] Speaker C: So that if you're needed, you can be right there to prevent somebody from fighting. [00:15:01] Speaker D: And if it leads to that, you can say, oh, you guys are not ready to solve this problem without hurting. We're going to wait till you're ready. So you don't let it go. So each child has to sit down and it's, we'll wait until you say that you're ready to do this. Nothing is more important than you getting along with your brother or sister, whatever it is. And you're stating, I'm going to make the time to make this happen. Most kids, after a few minutes, first of all, they won't believe that you're really going to follow through and that you're not going to walk away. But when they see that you really mean business and that you're not going to ignore what's happening, most kids are like, okay, I'm ready. [00:15:42] Speaker C: So the question of the child is, are you ready to solve this problem? What's the name of this problem? Oh, he took my car. Okay. Then it was, problem is, he took your car and we're going to solve it. But you both have to say that you're ready to solve it and nothing else is going to happen. Now this takes time. [00:15:59] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:16:00] Speaker C: The time you invest is so invaluable. [00:16:03] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:16:03] Speaker C: And it will, it will spill over into many, many areas. But you've got to make the time and you've got to make it clear to your children that you are really going to follow through here, that this is non negotiable. [00:16:14] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. And I think that the taking the time piece, I remember you saying, nothing is more important than, you know, you learning how to listen to your parent as well. And so if you have to have peanut butter and jelly for dinner, if you have to order a pizza, like whatever it is, that you make more time for yourself. [00:16:33] Speaker C: Yeah, yes. Yeah. It's very time consuming in the beginning, but boy, it really, really pays off. So you what? The mantra that I would use is with kids, name the problem. [00:16:46] Speaker D: And then. [00:16:47] Speaker C: Who has a good idea how to solve this problem? The kids. If you say, who has a good idea? Let me tell you, once some kid's going to be like, I do. Yeah, yeah, yeah, usually. [00:16:55] Speaker B: And the idea might not feel again equal to us as adults. Like it might be, okay, well, I'll play with this, you know, for 20 minutes and then you can have it for five. And you look at both children and say, does that work for you? [00:17:09] Speaker A: Yes. [00:17:10] Speaker B: You know, and if they say yes, you know, you let them come up with that solution. [00:17:14] Speaker C: That's right. [00:17:15] Speaker B: They both have to agree. But it doesn't, it doesn't have to be, okay, I'm going to set a timer. Right. [00:17:20] Speaker C: I was telling Rebecca my son would come up with solutions that I was like, really? You really think that's going to work for you? [00:17:28] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:17:28] Speaker C: But I realized that's what he came up with, and so that was honor. [00:17:33] Speaker B: Yeah, that's great. That's great. [00:17:35] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:17:35] Speaker B: And I think when they do get to that point of. Of hurting, to say there's. There's zero hurting. [00:17:43] Speaker C: Right. [00:17:43] Speaker B: In our family and keep coming back to that, even if it feels like it's happening all the time or it's. It's unpreventable or whatever it is. [00:17:51] Speaker C: And if you have any doubts about this, I will leave this with you. [00:17:55] Speaker A: 1. [00:17:56] Speaker C: Problem solving is one of the highest antecedents of intelligence. It's right up there at the top. So you're teaching your kids to be problem solvers. You're teaching your kids that problems can be solved. Can you imagine if had grown up thinking, oh, a problem, great. I can solve it? Yeah. No, a problem was horrible. Nobody wanted a problem and nobody wanted to solve it. [00:18:16] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:18:16] Speaker C: This is very, very different. And in doing this at the school where I worked, even the youngest, the two and a half and threes, would say, I have a good idea. You can solve this problem. I mean, that's radical. Absolutely. That is really incredible. And this will happen if you invest the time. Yeah. [00:18:36] Speaker B: And I think the other thing that works so well is that you become sort of like the narrator that's just neutrally stating what the problem is instead of, you know, well, who's. [00:18:47] Speaker D: That's. [00:18:48] Speaker B: Whose fault it is, who took it first, who had it. For trying not to get involved in all of that, but just saying, oh, well, what's the name of the problem? Or, oh, the name of the problem is two kids, one truck. You both want the truck. How are we going to solve it? Right, right. And I think parents get caught up on that. Well, I didn't see, you know, who had it first. Or I didn't see who took it. [00:19:09] Speaker D: Yes. [00:19:09] Speaker B: Or who should get punished, who shouldn't. But I think if it's more of this problem solving, then it works. [00:19:15] Speaker C: Right. And there's no need for punishment. Yeah, yeah. There's no need, because the kids are solving the problem in the structure that you've set up and not letting them just walk away. [00:19:24] Speaker B: Yeah. Like you said, instead of punishment, there's a solution. Right. And so trying to teach children that. That we don't necessarily need a punishment, we just need a solution. [00:19:34] Speaker C: Absolute. [00:19:34] Speaker B: And even I might take it to the next step with them and say, okay, so what are we gonna do next time? Right. There's two. Two children and one Truck. What are we gonna do next time when she takes your. Your car from you? What are you gonna say to her? What are you gonna do? And so that's. That's the solution instead of, you know, if you take the car from your sister, you're gonna have a timeout. Right. It's teaching them, what are you gonna do next time when you feel like taking the car? Or what are you gonna do if someone takes your car? How do you tell them? How do you. [00:20:05] Speaker C: When I first started using this at school, as I said, even with the youngest two and a half, some of them I thought were really pre verbal, but I. So I didn't really believe this, but I tried it out as I learned it, and I said, oh, two girls, one shovel. What are we going to do? And I waited, thinking, yeah, right. And this little girl who I had never heard speak, said, take a chair. And I was like, oh, my God. [00:20:32] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:20:32] Speaker C: I was so shocked. And I learned so much from that. And they worked it out, and there was no problem. So sometimes we underestimate what kids can do. [00:20:43] Speaker B: Absolutely. Absolutely. And I think it takes us out of the role, because what we don't want to be is we don't want to be the jury, we don't want to be the judge, we don't want to be the adjudicators. Right. Like, we really want to be there kind of narrating the problem for them. [00:20:56] Speaker C: Right. Unless there's hitting or hurting, and that's a different story. [00:21:00] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:21:00] Speaker C: And then in this case, we're talking about things. [00:21:03] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:21:04] Speaker C: Of just fighting over toys or. [00:21:06] Speaker B: Right, right. [00:21:06] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:21:07] Speaker B: But once there's. Once there's hurting, then. [00:21:09] Speaker C: Yes. Well, when somebody's hurt someone, you're not going to say, you're not going to get into a dialogue. It's just like, this is not. Okay. I will not let anyone hurt you, and I will not let you hurt anyone else. And you're not going to get into a big dialogue about it or say, oh, we have a problem. The problem is clear that somebody got hit. So I would bypass that, because what happens if you spend too much time on that? Kids get. Can learn to be manipulative about it, and you've lost the whole point, which is no hurting. So no hurting is very clear, very firm, and not a lot of dialogue. This. [00:21:45] Speaker D: Others. [00:21:45] Speaker C: These other incidences of just fighting over toys or really benefit from that approach. [00:21:52] Speaker B: Sure, sure. Yeah, Good distinction there. [00:21:54] Speaker C: Yeah, for sure. [00:21:57] Speaker B: Okay. Okay. Let's go to our next question, which is my younger child knows how to Push my older child's buttons and delights in making them mad. But then she complains that the older child doesn't like her. How do I bridge this gap? [00:22:16] Speaker C: That's a good one. [00:22:17] Speaker B: It's also becoming second nature to the older one to snap at almost anything the younger one does. Yeah, I, I mean to me what I'm hearing here is that the younger one is trying to connect. Right. Fundamentally the youngest child is trying to connect with the older one. And what they've gotten is a lot of negative feedback from the older child and they're wanting to connect and they don't. And this is the thing, and you'll see this with children to parents too, like children when they want to connect with their parent. It's almost impossible for a young child to go up to a parent and say, I really just need a hug right now. Right, right. But what are they going to do? They're going to throw something at you. They're going something that, that you don't want them to do and that will get your attention and that will get your attention and then you'll get that connection. So I, I think this happens a lot with siblings as well. And I think what's, what's happening here is the youngest is desperately wanting to connect with the older brother, doesn't know how to get a positive interaction from him and so she's doing the next best thing, which is okay, then I'll get a negative interaction from you. I think for me when this, these kinds of patterns happen in my own family is I've noticed that they just need some more time together in a positive way. You know, depending on their age it might be that we, you know, try not to over schedule our Saturday, but try, you know, which sounds scary but you know, if they're younger to stay home for a Saturday morning and say hey, you know, give them a few old sheets and say hey, do you think you guys can build a fort, you know, and give them something that they can actually ways that they connect time? Because one thing I noticed is that when we were on vacation they actually got along way better and I realized it was they had more time to free play together. [00:24:07] Speaker C: Oh, nice. [00:24:08] Speaker B: And to get into that space. And I think a lot of times siblings, it's like the morning rush, the evening rush and then sometimes, you know, in our over scheduled world the weekends are also rushed and so actually giving them some time if you, if they're older. And I think the person that wrote in actually one of, one of these kids is Much older. Another thing you can do is, like, have them babysit, which sounds crazy if you feel like they're always fighting. But I found with, like, when Joey was on babysitting mode, he was amazing and he would read stories and put them to bed and it was like he went into a different mode or, you know, say, hey, can you take your little sister to the park? Leave them alone together is key. Whether, you know, if that's younger. It's like leaving them to, you know, build a fort or to do something. Can you guys make a pretend campfire or, you know, make a tent or something, you know, but. But as they're older, like actually giving, you know, hey, go to the park. And one time when Maggie and Joey were kind of in this annoying stage of constantly kind of riling each other up, I. They were home from school for the day for whatever reason. Teacher. [00:25:14] Speaker C: How old were they? [00:25:15] Speaker B: So they were. Joey was in middle school, Maggie was probably in. Maybe they were sixth and eighth grade. But I gave them $20 each and I put them on a bus and I said, go to the mall. My only rule is that you stay together. You're not allowed to separate. But. And they, they came back and they were so great. And I've done that with Joey too. Like, he's taken Patchy to out on adventures. And so once they're a certain age, I think that's really important that. [00:25:46] Speaker D: Some. [00:25:46] Speaker B: Positive time together outside of the house. Just. [00:25:49] Speaker C: Although if you're too worried to do this, you could try it in your house. You know, you could say, I'm going to be very busy. I need a babysitter. You're in charge of watching your sister and then you're there and you can see how it's going. Give it a trial run. [00:26:04] Speaker B: Yeah. Especially if they're. If they're older or younger. [00:26:06] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, that sounds right. [00:26:08] Speaker B: But I think when the older child, like, goes into a little bit more of that responsibility mode, it does shift the dynamic. [00:26:16] Speaker D: Yes. [00:26:17] Speaker C: Oh, yeah, It's a great idea. [00:26:18] Speaker B: And the other thing I've done when they were really little is like, we've talked about floor time. I've actually done a floor time sessions when I feel like they just need more time to connect where you, you sit on the floor with the two siblings and try for, again, just 10 minutes, but try to think of a game that you can sort of teach the older one how to interact with the younger one. Um, and like, when they're in that stage where they love to knock things down, sit on the floor and show them that look, isn't it fun? If you build this really high, your s will knock it down and you try to build it faster than she can knock it down and things like that to where showing the older child that they can set up fun games that, that a toddler would like or that a younger child would like and put them in that more that leadership role. [00:27:01] Speaker C: Yeah, that's a great idea. [00:27:02] Speaker B: I think that makes a difference because yeah, I think that that fundamentally what's going on is they, they just need to connect and the younger child doesn't know how. Okay, so I think we have so many more questions that we're probably going to come back and do another episode. [00:27:18] Speaker C: Abso. [00:27:22] Speaker B: It's a big topic and we have some more questions that we'll come back to. Like the child that constantly wants to race against their sibling and always has to win. And we have questions about the bedtime circus and riling each other up. Right. That is a hard one when you feel like the children are conspiring against you as a parent. And yeah, we definitely have some more questions that we want to answer. I think this is. Is such a hot topic. [00:27:48] Speaker C: Oh, we'll come back to it. [00:27:49] Speaker B: Yeah. Awesome. [00:27:51] Speaker C: All right, thank you. [00:27:52] Speaker B: Stay tuned. [00:27:53] Speaker A: Thank you so much for listening to Parenting Matters. Real talk from toddlers to teens where your personal parenting journey matters and your. [00:28:02] Speaker B: Questions are always welcome. [00:28:04] Speaker A: If you've enjoyed today's podcast, we'd love it. If you'd like, subscribe, leave a rating and review and share this podcast with a friend. It really helps others find us and supports the work we are doing to support parents near and far. Check out the show notes, leave your parenting questions in the comments or head to our dedicated webpage earlychildhoodmatters.org podcast. 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